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Old 04-13-2012, 04:13 AM
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Oni Oni is offline
 
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Default The jab, step, and hook

So I was reading "Jeet Kune Do: Bruce Lee's Commentaries on the Martial Way" earlier and noticed something strange while looking at page 162. I'll be testing it out later down training but I'd never heard of it before now and was wondering if you guys had any info on it.

I will quote it word for word below.

1. Jab, without stepping with the right foot
2. Hold the arm extended and walk to the arm. Elbow is thus bent to position of a hook and held off the right shoulder.
3. Whip a short hook to opponent's chin
4. Perform the movement fast! Successful execution depends upon deception and speed.


So am I right in assuming you throw a stationary jab without over committing, you step forward while keeping your hand extended and allow your body to catch up to the position of the hand, and then turn it into a lead hook? Sounds like it'll be hard to get fluid so I imagine it'll take a while to drill, but I'll experiment with it on the bag later until it's smooth enough to use in sparring.

Any one else tried this? Had success? Very interested in testing it out as it's different to anything I've encountered before. Heard about throwing a stationary punch and letting your body catch up to it before from an old school 60 year old karate guy down our club but never put any time into trying it out.

Page 162 of the below book, 4/5ths of the way down the page


Edit: I know about the regular combination of jab/hook. It's the fact the hand is left extended and the body is walked to the hand rather than pulling the hand back that has my interest.

Last edited by Oni; 04-14-2012 at 10:48 PM.
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Old 04-13-2012, 06:51 AM
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DubhGhail DubhGhail is offline
 
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I'm not sure about the "walk to the arm" bit, but I have noticed a tendency for hook to fall short.

There seem to be two factors involved. The first is that the focus mitts can create a false sense of distance for the hook. You can do "jab, hook" or "jab, cross, hook" and your hook will be in range without neccessarily needing to shuffle forward.

The second is that people are lazy. Put someone on the heavy bag and tell them to do "jab, cross, hook" and thirty seconds later they're doing ridiculously short, cramped straight punches to save themselves the effort of stepping forward for the hook.

Jump into sparring after training your hooks this way and you'll find them either missing or turning into long haymakers or both.

Solution: Teach yourself to always step forward when transitioning from straight punches to hooks. Make it part of the combo. "Jab, step, hook" and "jab, cross, step, hook". Percentage of hits miraculously goes up.

Now, I've also noticed that if you step on the jab it makes it just a little bit harder to step on the hook as well. It can be done, obviously, but just takes a little more pratice. For that reason I would first teach beginners a stationary jab, followed by a step into the hook. I think maybe that's what the above quote is trying to get at.
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Old 04-13-2012, 07:26 AM
minasz minasz is offline
 
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Its a western boxing combination i often use in my training and throw in sparring.

Jab and step in with a hook.
I mostly follow with a left cross and right hook, uppercut or ellbow.

From there you can decide to grab and engage or disengage and go further with hitting combo's.
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Old 04-14-2012, 03:35 AM
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Where I use the jab hook combination often, what interests me with this is the fact Bruce Lee said to Jab and then walk to the arm, as if you're extending your arm first and then letting your body catch up to it, THEN throwing the hook.

Can anyone think of any tactical principle or reasoning for this? I'm sure he had one but I'm curious as to what it is.
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Old 04-14-2012, 08:16 AM
Sheever Sheever is offline
 
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the problem with this is the step in should allowed by the opponent.the hook goes broken rhythm.basically the hook goes "behind the jab" whenever I tried this in sparring 9 times out of 10 was successful.you can turn the hook halfway from jab.the step is for closing in is not the standard boxing combination.
Tactically its a fast finish attack.

Last edited by Sheever; 04-14-2012 at 08:23 AM.
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Old 04-14-2012, 09:10 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sheever View Post
the problem with this is the step in should allowed by the opponent.the hook goes broken rhythm.basically the hook goes "behind the jab" whenever I tried this in sparring 9 times out of 10 was successful.you can turn the hook halfway from jab.the step is for closing in is not the standard boxing combination.
Tactically its a fast finish attack.
Makes me wonder if the purpose of doing it with a stationary jab, leaving the arm extended and then stepping to catch up to the fist and THEN hooking is to make opponent misjudge distance maybe? So they'd think they're out of your range and surprise, bam! Weird timing too so I figure that's also a part of it.

You throw a normal jab and they think you're out of range, then you catch up to the fist and surprise hook while they think their distance is still safe? That can be the only purpose I can imagine, not sure if it'd work or not but if Bruce Lee saw worth in writing it down I imagine it has it's uses.

Last edited by Oni; 04-14-2012 at 09:17 AM.
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Old 04-14-2012, 12:27 PM
minasz minasz is offline
 
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It is a boxing combination ive learned from my boxing trainer when i was training for fights in Muay Thai.

The jab is making him retreat a little, thats why you step in to hookpunch.
So the hook will pressure forward and by stepping in the hook will be harder.
Great to follow up with a cross, hook combo to knock of the chin.

This is done in broken rythem.

Last edited by minasz; 04-14-2012 at 12:30 PM.
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Old 04-14-2012, 12:39 PM
BRCLRY BRCLRY is offline
 
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Quote:
Tactically its a fast finish attack
Right! its all done in one motion 1-1.5 beats. If the Jab doesnt hit them, you still enter behind a hook, and follow up.
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Old 04-14-2012, 09:51 PM
BryanStoops BryanStoops is offline
 
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Default Hook Concerns

I've seen two BIG guys (one a very muscular FBI agent and another just a LARGE guy with a lot of mass) tear their bicep tendons in class sparring smaller opponents because they threw hooks that were all arm punches.

The jab/hook idea in question sounds a lot like the 1/3 series (the jab is the 1 and the hook is the 3). All of the ideas already contributed about timing on this thread are very insightful. Just make sure that the hook is an extension of your body weight being dropped back (which is why you will sometimes see people come up on their lead toe when they practice hooks), other wise it's the mass of your arm against the mass of your target, which can REALLY be bad if the target executes something like a tight cover.

That being written, I love the jab/hook combo!
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Old 04-14-2012, 10:44 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BryanStoops View Post
I've seen two BIG guys (one a very muscular FBI agent and another just a LARGE guy with a lot of mass) tear their bicep tendons in class sparring smaller opponents because they threw hooks that were all arm punches.

The jab/hook idea in question sounds a lot like the 1/3 series (the jab is the 1 and the hook is the 3). All of the ideas already contributed about timing on this thread are very insightful. Just make sure that the hook is an extension of your body weight being dropped back (which is why you will sometimes see people come up on their lead toe when they practice hooks), other wise it's the mass of your arm against the mass of your target, which can REALLY be bad if the target executes something like a tight cover.

That being written, I love the jab/hook combo!
Jab/hook one of my favourite combinations also, one of the first ones I learned a long time ago and someone nicknamed it "the corkscrew" when it was taught to me. Interests me in changing the timing like this though, with leaving the hand extended and walking to the hand.

My sifu Mark also teaches the hook with the body weight changing so the lead foot goes onto the ball and the back foot goes onto the heel.

Quote:
Originally Posted by minasz View Post
It is a boxing combination ive learned from my boxing trainer when i was training for fights in Muay Thai.

The jab is making him retreat a little, thats why you step in to hookpunch.
So the hook will pressure forward and by stepping in the hook will be harder.
Great to follow up with a cross, hook combo to knock of the chin.

This is done in broken rythem.
I've learned it a similar way also, only the difference with the technique in this thread is that the hand is left extended and the body is walked to it rather than pulling back the jab. That's the thing that's caught my attention.

Last edited by Oni; 04-14-2012 at 10:47 PM.
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