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Old 07-07-2010, 06:25 AM
vhk vhk is offline
 
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Default Timing of the shoulder and hip rotation for the straight lead

For the stationary straight lead, after the rotation of the rear leg, should the rotation of the hips start slightly before the rotation of the shoulders? I find that if my hip rotation starts slightly before my shoulder rotation, I feel that my fists "shoots" out a little more naturally, as if propelled by a rubber band/whip.

In other words, my hips rotate and then my shoulders "catch up" to their rotation, which helps snaps my hand out quickly. My line of reasoning is that a "kinetic chain" should occur, the "energy" starting at the rear foot, moving up to the hips, through the shoulders, and finally ending at the elbow: thus, first the rear foot fires via a push off and rotation, then a millisecond later the hips twist, another millisecond later, the shoulders rotate, and the elbow snaps a microsecond after the shoulder rotation. I imagine this to hold true for the moving lead too, with the exception that the hand moves a bit before the foot to help disguise the intention.

However, I'm not sure if this is more or less efficient than simply pushing off the rear foot while rotating the hips and shoulder at the same time.
Any thoughts on this would be greatly appreciated. Thanks!
-Vincent
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Old 07-07-2010, 07:59 AM
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Tim Tackett Tim Tackett is offline
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Hip before hand when stationary. Hand first when moving forward.
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Old 07-07-2010, 08:57 AM
vhk vhk is offline
 
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Sifu Tackett, thank you taking the time to reply.
Hip before hand, when stationary, but should it also be hip rotation before shoulder whirl?
-Vincent
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Old 07-07-2010, 10:50 AM
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Yes! hip 1st
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Old 07-07-2010, 12:08 PM
vhk vhk is offline
 
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Thank you, Sifu!
-Vincent
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Old 07-09-2010, 08:46 PM
BRCLRY BRCLRY is offline
 
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Default Hip before hand when stationary

Hey Mr. Tacket,
In my school we train the stationary jab with the hand moving first and the the hip and foot moving simultaniously at the last possible moment before impact. My Sifu is 2nd generation under Jerry Potteet, and as I understand it, the wednesday night group JKD came from Dan Inosanto's back yard group, and Jerry Potteet's from Bruce Lee's back yard group. This is an interesting difference in mechanics, what is your insight on this? Is it just how the mechanics evolved, are there liabilities or advantages to either. Sorry if its a dense question.

PS. I always wondered what you meant when you said Bob Bremmer learned the leg obstruction differently too.

Thanks,
Mark
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Old 07-10-2010, 07:21 AM
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We do the straight lead the way Bruce taught Bremer to do at Bruce's house on one of the Sundays that Bremer would go over whenever Bruce had spare time and would call Bob to come train. We break down the straight lead in our Chinatown book. We do hand 1st when moving forward. The way you describe how Jerry Poteet teaches it is how I learned it from Sifu Inosanto. They are both a way to do it. Whatever way works the best for you is the best way.
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Old 07-10-2010, 06:17 PM
BRCLRY BRCLRY is offline
 
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we played with both today, it seems like a completely different tool, and I can see why holding the fist at 45, seems easier to make it pop.
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Old 07-11-2010, 08:31 AM
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Keep playing with both of them. Sometimes you may want to do one. Another time the other way.
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Old 07-30-2010, 07:27 PM
BRCLRY BRCLRY is offline
 
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Hey to whoever reads this, and Mr Tackett please feel free to correct me if im wrong on any of this.

As I said before I was told hand moves first with the stationary lead/jab, but Ive read that the WNG advocates hip first.

Ive played with both, and found what works best for me, im just sharing because I assume there are people like me reading these boards. I have found that the hip needs to lead the shoulder by a hair for max power, but if my hand moves first im less telegraphic and my hand sort of pulls my body into the punch easier. My compromise is that I started to train my hand to shoot out first, and whip my hip into it so that it passes my target a hair before my fist touches the target. I later learned that this is how the higher level guys in my class do the punch anyways.
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