View Full Version : Professor Hargreaves / Layton West - Trained By?

07-22-2006, 05:59 PM

Who was this guy trained by - Professor Hargreaves?


And this guy - Layton West???

As both look & sound highly suspicious as they are not open about their backgrounds & who actually taught them JKD; at least nothing on their websites, and you ask around people don't seem to know either.

Look out for the highly comical ' partial resume' of Prof. Hargraves with his 7/8th Dans, etc. Mention of Gary Dill on his site, maybe he was trained by him? Not to mention the hilarious photo in Kung Fu jacket with togs, you ever seen any JKD instructor in the world wear that, especially a caucasian? And hate to say it, but he clearly doesn't look in any sort of fighting shape.

Layton West claims he trained for several years under a direct student of Bruce Lee (not Inosanto) but has never named him? Highly suspect, but if true maybe the Bruce Lee student threatned him not to tell anyone he taught him as if you watch Layton West's videos his standard is poor!

Just curious , as have came across those names from time to time, and even been asked who trained them. Also supposedly Layton West's JKD Street Defence video is supposedly best selling JKD instructional video ever (???) , maybe because it sold for so little.

For years Layton West had ads in 'Black Belt', 'Inside Kung Fu' , etc and people then were saying who is he/ who taught him.

07-23-2006, 12:57 AM
Hey RockSolid,

You may find this forum is not exactly the place to call into question other people's training, etc. It's a place to discuss JKD and techniques, etc. No politics is usually the name here.

Carter Hargrave has been discussed much on Paul Bax's forum, go over there and run a search. http://pauljbax.forumco.com

I think Layton has been spoke of there as well. Good luck.

07-23-2006, 04:43 AM
Not 'calling into question' as you put it, merely asking who they were trained by.

This is a JKD forum, if people have queries about an Instructor, here is good place to ask; there are many 'in the know' as they say.

Any public JKD Instructor should be open about who they trained under, if they are not it looks suspicious.

If Bruce Lee's art is to be preserved then peoples lineage is good place to look for prospective students of any Instructor e.g.

Bruce Lee > Dan Inosanto > Paul Vunak
Tao of JKD/BL Books/JKD Videos/Few Seminars > Instructor

The latter is highly suspect but there are quite a few out there like that.

Why would anyway hide or not answer questions regarding who they trained under? Everyone here appears very open - ask Tim Tackett, Lamar Davies, etc they will tell you no problem who they trained under.

It should be something to be proud of e.g. - ' I trained under 3 of Bruce Lee's direct students for 5 years'.

07-24-2006, 02:19 AM
Hey Rock,

I totally agree with you 100% man, I think you should be able to declare it, and with pride. If you don't... then that definitely brings eyebrows into the sky.

I was just suggesting this particular topic may lead to some dissing on somebody - and I think this particular forum is down on dissing, so to speak.

Paul Bax's forum is definitely not down on dissing, and states the truth with a slap to the face - so go check the archives over there, you'll find what you seek.

08-18-2006, 07:46 AM
IIRC Hargrave is a 10th degree Kenpo black belt who learned his JKD from Gary Dill. I guess you would have to train with him to see how you like him. I got his inch-punch video years ago, and thought it was not nearly as good as similar material by Strong and DeMile. I have no idea if he has trained under a direct student of Lee. IIRC Dill studied with JY Lee after Bruce had left Oakland.

04-03-2010, 11:14 PM
Hey sorry, I know this is like 4 years too late, but I think he is really suss (Hargraves) First, in his FAQ he says, quite clearly that JKD is a STYLE. *rages quietly*

Then he gets this: Unlike Sifu Hargrave why are so many teachers in JKD fat and out of shape.

... let's see I'll diss him cos he's dissing others.

Nad last but not least, his 'training' videos are all edited on a Mac, with the lowest quality equipment. Expert Village is Better than that.

Oh and his home navigation bars are stolen from the apple website.

04-04-2010, 06:26 AM
as mentioned on this forum before it is best to private message tim or one of the others here to ask specifically about another person. posts such as these tend to get out of hand and create problems. i asked a simple question one time about a jkd instructor and it got all turned around and that instructor caught wind of it and posted on here. after that thread tim suggested that anyone asking about instructors should direct it in the private message.

Tim Tackett
04-04-2010, 08:32 AM
I don't like to discuss any JKD teachers to anyone unless what I have to say is positive. This includes private messages. It's not too hard to find out on your own who is legit or not. As a general note:
Be aware of JKD belts and JKD Masters.

04-04-2010, 12:47 PM
We only talk technique here.